#50017 [Opn]: Nomenclature ltrim/rtrim semantically incorrect, ignores RTL writing systems!

ID: 50017 Updated by: thiago@php.net Reported By: stefan at digitalekunst dot ac dot at Status: Open Bug Type: Documentation problem PHP Version: Irrelevant Assigned To: thiago New Comment: 2) For even better transparency, I have some ideas: (a/b) Notify the submitting email-address about deletion. This already happens, but in your note you did not specify an email address, all you typed on your email was: "StefanNowak". We can't send an email to that. :) 2) (c) JS on docs... I'm not sure why (probably for usability), but we don't use JS on php.net website. This could be more clarified by someone responsible. 3) Concerning the issue: (c) Demonstrate your respect/sensitivity... This could be done by adding some of Usamah's text into docs. 4) What are the further steps? (a) Is the discussion continued here... This bug will be here so we can track the new text to be added. (b) Who will be the final decision maker? Probably Phillip :) I don't feel confident enough to add text to main EN tree, so if anyone else would take this, It'd be awesome. Previous Comments: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ [2009-10-27 18:42:13] stefan at digitalekunst dot ac dot at @thiago & @philip 1) Thanks for: (a) Showing me how to access deleted comments: Both mine and in general. (b) The reasoning for the deletion. This is good transparency (at least after my request). 2) For even better transparency, I have some ideas: (a) Notify the submitting email-address about deletion. I only realised the deletion by revisiting and looking for reactions. b) When deleting/rejecting comments possibly add a standardized/individual reasoning remark. (c) Javascript on comment page: When someone requests an orphaned anchor on a PHP manual page, such as: http://www.php.net/manual/en/function.ltrim.php#comment-id Inform, that the comment was removed, and may offer a link to: http://news.php.net/php.notes/comment-id 3) Concerning the issue: (a) I understand that renaming such a heavily used function is out of the question. But nevertheless I propose consequences: (b) Nomenclature/style guidelines which emphasize to be as cultural/ideology neutral and as universal as possible. (c) Demonstrate your respect/sensitivity towards cultural openness by now retroactively establishing the aliases whose documentation shall have a slight section, which explains that the aliases were added because of the respect/openness approach, and links to the nomenclature/style guidelines. 4) What are the further steps? (a) Is the discussion continued here, or will the issue be transferred to internals@lists.php.net? Are you doing this, or shall I do it? (b) Who will be the final decision maker? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ [2009-10-27 15:27:45] philip@php.net Agreed, this comment doesn't add anything useful to the PHP Manual. We document ltrim() as ltrim() because it's named ltrim(). Same logic applies to rtrim(). However, information based on the user note from Usamah deserves integration into the manual for these two pages. As for the topic itself, I highly doubt these commonly used functions will be renamed (or aliased) and instead assume proper documentation will be the solution. However, discussing on internals@lists.php.net is possible. Note: all user note activity is archived here: - http://news.php.net/php.notes And your note being deleted: - http://news.php.net/php.notes/162109 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ [2009-10-27 12:23:11] thiago@php.net Stefan, I removed your comment for the following reasons: 1 - Usamah's comment is enough for explaining the function differences on those languages. 2 - It just stands for saying your opinion, and doc notes are not the right place for this. 3 - You're suggesting a change/fix/feature, it should be done by adding a bug on this system. Your original comment is below: I agree with Usamah M dot Ali (usamah1228 at gmail dot com)! I think that the nomenclature of ltrim and rtrim is very poor, as it has a bias towards left-to-right writing systems! I suggest to rather call them btrim (trim at beginning of the character stream) and etrim (trim at end of the character stream), as this would be universally true without any bias. Honestly this issue doesn't amaze me, because it reflects the sad reality that quite a number of people, studying technical subjects, often don't receive any humanistic/general education in their curricula at all! ------------------------------------------------------------------------ [2009-10-27 12:05:31] stefan at digitalekunst dot ac dot at Description: ------------ I have posted a comment at: http://www.php.net/manual/en/function.ltrim.php#68677 It was removed! Why? My content did not contradict the rules. I guess it was removed because I critisiced the naming convention of ltrim/rtrim, and agreed with "Usamah M dot Ali". 1) I did not save a copy of the comment on my computer. Is there a versioning system of the documentation comments, which can restore my comment? I would like to have it for myself please, and as the original source for discussing the issue! 2) I would like a serious explanation, why it was removed. 3) I would like to stimulate a discussion, about what I criticized. I think that cultural ignorance/unawareness is simply not a good mindset for a globalized co-operation project such as PHP. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- Edit this bug report at http://bugs.php.net/?id=50017&edit=1