Re: More SOAP or Dampen Thy Evangelical Fires oh Disciples

On Tue, 6 Jun 2000, Ryan Gaul wrote: > Well, to answer some of the responses I've read. > > Fighting Microsoft - > Well, the best way to fight Microsoft's embrace and extend approach is to > embrace yourself. Whatever you may say, IE does a better job of supporting new No, be cause you validate their clames that the standard is good, and then they extend it to be incompatable and since they are the standard platform, you have to go along, or be left behind. > standards than Netscape (excluding Mozilla, of course). Microsoft is doing a Thats because netscape is dead. Microsoft killed it. > lot to embrace XML. If we don't embrace them as well, we lose control of the > standard, and we are forced to use Microsoft products in our work-a-day lives. Either way we loose it. Better to not push it in the begining and hope it doesnt become as big a standard. > My reason for wanting to support SOAP is that I can use it to sell a > FreeBSD/Apache/PHP/Postgres solution to an otherwise Microsoft shop. It allows Microsofts shops choose Microsoft not because they are good, but because they are Microsoft. Microsoft shops are natorious for not using any non ms products. > me to integrate my product with their future plans, and perhaps even to > influence their view of open source software. The best way to fight Microsoft > is to beat them at their own game, in my not so humble opinion. Not posible to beat MS at their own game. their just too good at it. > > CORBA - > I don't know CORBA. I couldn't help you there. And it's my understanding that > there are several abortive efforts underway to move CORBA support into PHP. > At any rate, CORBA has more to fear from Sun than Microsoft. SOAP is not a > competitor to CORBA. SOAP is not a competitor for CORBA. It doesn't dictate > any object model. CORBA and COM can communicate using SOAP. SOAP's competitors > are: DCOM, IIOP, Java RMI, WDDX, and WIDL. SOAP needs something else to work, > like CORBA, or JAVA, or Perl, or hopefully PHP. From what I have heard (correct me if I'm wrong), SOAP is a compeditor to CORBA. SOAP rides on xml-rpc which is what does the communicating. > > Open Source HOOHAA - > Well, supporting an open protocal that is really just XML over HTTP isn't > exactly bowing to Microsoft. Anyways, I never suggested moving this into the > heart of PHP. I was aiming more at a collection of PHP Classes with which to > implement SOAP messages. Though, now that I think of it, the former may be the > better approach. > > At any rate, I am also an open source bigot. I only want to support SOAP > because it seems: > > a) quite useful for my specific needs Ok. > b) to have industry momentum We dont want momentum in a new "standard" when a perfectly good one already exists. CORBA. > c) frees me from heavyweight programming with protocols like JAVA RMI, CORBA and > DCOM (Shudder). I'm not sure of that. > d) lets me do something simply and quickly. CORBA does too. > e) it's kind of a good idea. No more so then CORBA. > > Security - > Security is always an exercise left to the reader. Don't do stupid things and > bad things won't happen to you. Since SOAP rides on HTTP, it is no more or > less secure than that protocol. It's what you allow it to do that makes it > dangerous. A SOAP request doesn't do anything unless you make it. Don't make > it do stupid things. Simple. This is totally off. Your saying SOAP rides on HTTP, so it cant be less secure then HTTP. Thats like saying, Visual Basic Script can be no more dangerious then the text file it resides in. An unknown SOAP object running on your machine when you run "joebobapp" can connect to a remote host via http, and share out the box via itself. And it would be unblockabe via firewalls. Major security risk. > > > Ryan Gaul > > > > -- > Homer: Aw, Marge, kids, I miss my club. > > Marge: Oh, Homey. You know, you are a member of a very exclusive > club. > > Homer: The Black Panthers? > > Homer the Great > > -- > PHP Development Mailing List <http://www.php.net/> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: php-dev-unsubscribe@lists.php.net > For additional commands, e-mail: php-dev-help@lists.php.net > To contact the list administrators, e-mail: php-list-admin@lists.php.net >