RE: [PHP] Paying Job...

Well, the original question is actually a good one. I was faced with it when I first tried doing free-lance. I had programming and database experience (MS Access, MSSQL, VB...everyone can barf now), a little html experience but no experience combining the two. The first people to give me jobs and references were friends. They trusted me and I think that is what helped make the process a success. At first it was very long hours as I studied and learned ASP (barf again), JavaScript, development of graphics and the more advanced HTML options. I told them that I would charge them about $60/hour and provided estimates of the number of hours it would take to develop something. Truth is that intitally I wound up spending a lot more time on each project than I expected. but kept to my quotes As I learned I was able to shorten the time frame. And I also built a library of code that I was able to apply to other clients. I also developed a list of sites, newsgroups and listserves to get answers or code from when I hit a roadblock. As for the price, some people balked at that rate. Truth is in Washington DC that was below market. And while some people would say 'well you were only earning xxx when you were at yyy' I explained to them that I had to factor in costs of business that I don't get paid for: invoicing, paying bills, recruiting new clients, software, hardware, my own benefits and so forth. Overall, while I did not make as much as I hoped, the experience was a tremendous value. Working for one self makes you realize that each hour you are not working you are not making money (um like my spending time to answer this right now <grin>). It really increases your productivity in that way. I also used down time to persue projects that I was simply interested in. There were perks, I got to deduct the cost of my cell phone and DSL as business expenses. The down side is that I was literally working in my closet. I didn't get out nearly as much as I probably should have. And living where you work is not for everyone. Furthermore, I hated invoicing, paying bills and other administrative matters. When my computer went down (power supply) I had to set up an old computer to use for back up (word to the wise here). I also had to learn a lot more up and down wind from me. In other words, I had to learn some server administration and even more about hardware specs and configuration. I wound up setting up my home computer as a web server using my DSL connection. I highly recommend this as it will allow you to host your sites until the client approves and you post to their site. It is good to have a working model they can review with you. You will find that they change their minds alot. If I could do one other thing differently, I would have purchased a laptop going into it. It would have afforded me a lot more flexibility of getting out of the house and working at the coffee shop or somewhere else. I have one now (dual boot with WinXP and Linux-Red-Hat-MYSQL-PHP-Apache), it is worth the extra costs. Good luck and keep us posted. Paul David Buerer wrote: > And Tyler...rest assured you would never be working for me with an > attitude > like that. Nor would I ever recommend that you work for one of my > clients. > > It's not about making as much as you can, it's about making what is fair, > deserved, and reasonable. Someone else said that what we're providing is > a service. He's right. First you consult with your clients,then you go sit > in a dark room and make it happen. I think that most freelancers will > agree that the job is actually about 30% code writing and 70% consultant. > Consulting and providing quality service is about relationships, honesty, > and ultimatly trust. Trying to rape your clients just because you can > will not do any of the above. > > That's just my point of view..... > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tyler Longren [mailto:tyler@captainjack.com] > Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 9:05 AM > To: Martin Clifford > Cc: php-general@lists.php.net > Subject: Re: [PHP] Paying Job... > > > Why even bother charging money if you aren't out to make as much as you > can? That's just my point of view. > > tyler > > On Thu, 25 Jul 2002 11:59:28 -0400 > "Martin Clifford" <MLC1@nrc.gov> wrote: > >> <<resists the urge to debate ethics>> >> >> Why didn't you just say, "Charge by whichever will screw the client >> the worst."? Jesus. >> >> Martin >> >> >>> Tyler Longren <tyler@captainjack.com> 07/25/02 11:44AM >>> >> Charge by which ever will get you the most money. >> >> tyler >> >> On Thu, 25 Jul 2002 11:46:38 -0400 >> Gerard Samuel <gsam@trini0.org> wrote: >> >> > Basically, someone is looking to get a database driven site built, >> > and Ive never written code for money before. Im looking for advice, >> > as to how the experienced coders in here charge >> > >> > for their work. >> > Do you charge by the page, script or by the hour (that would be >> > nice). >> > >> > Thanks for any input you may provide... >> > >> > -- >> > Gerard Samuel >> > http://www.trini0.org:81/ >> > http://dev.trini0.org:81/ >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) >> > To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php >> > >> >> -- >> PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) >> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php >> >> >> >> -- >> PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) >> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php >> >