Re: PATCH: debug_backtrace() function for 4.3-dev/ZE1

--- Andi Gutmans <andi@zend.com> wrote: > At 12:30 PM 8/19/2002 +0200, you wrote: > >On Mon, Aug 19, 2002 at 11:45:30AM +0300, Zeev Suraski wrote: > > > > > > How often do you call a function that gives you your current backtrace in > > > C? In my many years of C experience, I would have to say that the > > accurate > > > answer is -0- times. You really should compare apples with apples... > > > > you often said in the past that you don't write php-apps, you > > write php. i do write php-apps, and debug_backtrace() is one > > of the most useful features if your app reaches an > > "unexpected failure" (= likely a bug). right now i load some > > zend-extension on my devel boxes - but (as you know), the > > unexpected often only happens on productions systems. my > > production systems are soo loaded that i cannot afford to > > load the zend-extension on there. so post-mortem analysis is > > much harder there, and you know how hard it sometimes is to > > reporduce bugs (remember how often i spend hours just to sent > > you guys the shortest-possible testcase for bugs?) > > > > but - in a way you are right, i'm comparing apples and pies. > > the debug_backtrace() for me is like calling abort() in my > > c-code to be able to inspect the core-file and see where > > things went wrong. > > > > anyway, i don't thing we are discussing the usefullness of > > debug_backtrace() here. > > > > i think andi will look over the one critical line of the > > patch - if he agrees that this change is "ok", i will go > > ahead and commit. > > I still think it shouldn't go in. This is the only feature in Engine 2 > which might make non-OOP people convert. Once this isn't in Engine 2 we > don't have a carrot for them. You as a Zend owner who's business could be very propitable for Zend2 success or you as a php developer, think that debug_backtrace is bad for php. Sometimes I think that your and zeev's ideas are more business oriented than better for the php community. I'm sure im wrong but thats the way it seems from where I sit. I think that Thies is right he's not trying to back port all of the zend2 functionality but debug_backtrace should have been in many years ago. Holding back such an important feature just so more people would move to zend2 isnt going to make zend2 more popular but I think it doesn't move php forward at all. I would like to see everyone to move to zend2 but we all know that isn't going to happen with our without including debug_backtrace to zend1, php4 isn't going to go away as easy as php3 did no matter how big the carrot is. > Why can't you respect this way of thinking? Especially as I wrote the code? > You're basically saying screw them because I'll commit it anyway. I think he should commit it anyways. He isn't disrespecting you he just feels strongly against you (as do alot of others). Sometimes I don't think you respect their way of thinking. Sorry if this email sounds like its attacking you. It isn't intended to. - Brad __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs http://www.hotjobs.com