Re: Group/Community Disconnect

On Jun 9, 2004, at 10:50 PM, Paul M Jones wrote:

Hi, Helgi, On Jun 9, 2004, at 3:39 PM, Helgi Þormar wrote:

To illustrate: Of the 6 negative votes for Savant, 5 are from the Group. All of the 12 positive votes are from regular non-Group developers. What does this say about the disconnect between the Group and the community? The PEAR community is speaking; PEAR Group should listen.

Tell me, who says that those votes come from some PEAR Group decision ?

Not saying it's a Group "decision" per se, but it's obvious to me that Group members share a set of values that is not shared by the rest of the community.

Well the group members are by far the more experienced in PEAR so perhaps they are right and we are wrong ?

Also what's up with this fetish of yours with the PEAR Group?

Heh. :-) Not a fetish at all, sorry it looks that way. Let's just say I'm a stickler for good management and a troublemaker to boot; call me an Ogre.

Paul, it doesn't look that way and it is not that way. Votes are from group members in their quality of developers, the fact that they are also group members is not relevant to the discussion. Please note that we have very open policies on PEAR. On PECL is a senior developer says no about an extension it's a No not a "let's ask the community". Each Open Source projects needs a Leadership, self regulation is very often a bad thing in Open source.

Seems everything that goes wrong for you here in anyway, or that you see something wrong, then you start blaming that the PEAR Group doesn't do this and should do that and yara yara yara ...

Not at all -- I only talk about PEAR Group when they start talking about policy.

This is starting to be very annoying IMO.

Sorry, sorry, not trying to be an annoyance -- but I gotta call it when I think I see it.

.... you saw nothing. Just some negative votes and in lieu of moving ahead with the main goal you just went saying something irrelevant to the topic which was Savant not PEAR group, not PEAR policies.

Even though member of the group don't agree with you in something, then it doesn't mean that it's a decision from the group, those members are also individuals that can speak their own mind, with out being linked to the group.

Sure they can, and I welcome it! But as I said before, they seem to share a set of values that is not in line with the rest of the community (well, the 5 who have voted on Savant, anyway, the remaining two may prove me wrong).

Who voted +1, including me, is hardly representing the whole community. PEAR group is also part of the community. Cheers David P.S. If I get fired from work for spending so much time on the ML I will blame you ;)

Only my 2 cents.

Only my 1 cent, and bent on one end at that. :-) -- Paul M. Jones Savant: the simple alternative to Smarty for PHP. http://phpsavant.com/ DB_Table: build RDBMS tables and XHTML forms in one PHP class. http://wiki.ciaweb.net/yawiki/index.php?area=DB_Table Yawiki: a collaborative online documentation system. http://wiki.ciaweb.net/yawiki/index.php?area=Yawiki Yawp: a single-file foundation for PHP applications. http://phpyawp.com/ -- PEAR Development Mailing List (http://pear.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php